When one of these countries "concerned" about the genocide in Gaza calls for a UN peace-keeping force to enter Gaza and an embargo on all trade with Israel, then I will believe that they actually care about the Palestinians.
Disingenuous and cowardly and just as insidious as Trump, Starmer, a human right attorney is jailing and oppressing senior citizens for peacefully opposing a genocide. And Macron is still going strong with the fallacy of a 2 state solution and pushing war mongering. Starmer just embraced Trump and Mileikowsky, war criminals. No paragons of democracy or human decency these two.
“. . . all the states jumping on board (to recognize a Palestinian state) have hooked their recognition to the demilitarization of a people facing genocide . . . .”
And this is contingent on the Palestinians “demonstrating progress” toward democratization, to acquiescing to their continued subjugation. So, the victims of genocide must prove something. What does Israel, the perpetrator of genocide, have to prove? What a sham.
These governments are evil and should be called out and repudiated by their own people as well as the rest of the world. The U.S., of course, is the worst of all.
Its been going on all of my lifetime. I've lived with , worked and spoken to Jews since I was thirteen, when I first moved into a jewish area, After a while all of my friend were Jewish,. they all lied about Israels treatment of Bedouins, and Palestinians constantly.
Now I know they were lieing. The Jewish Diaspora is just as guilty as Israel. I lived and worked with them all of my life. , I'm 82 now.
I worked in mainland China a fair bit, for a chinese patron, I had to get used to him constantly lying ?. about the business we were doing ?
The islamists in China are not Arabs, therefore not " Brothers "
Bit like the Jews in Israel , Their mostly European, not middle eastern.
I'm Anglo Saxen. brought up alongside non religious Jews, And belong to no orthodox religion.
And couldnt care less about anyone who is bogged down in religion.
My advise to such people is, get out , I'm not interested in wasting my time talking about your god. Also ignorance plays a big part in what you were saying,
Chinese are great liers about their abuse. they seem to be a bit immune to others suffering.
But if you want to talk about lyeing then just look at the Jewish answer to everything . A F**ING LIE. no one can deny Israel is a lyeing state thats for sure now , and I thought the Chinese hadit.
It won't end the genocide,, but it is a good start in redressing the Palestinians' exclusion from a seat at the Table last century, while accepting Rothschild's money to give a Zionist seat at it, from which the Balfour resolution emanated.
I do not detest Israel, but do detest Netanyahu and his ultra conservative far right religious bigot coalition. Most Israelis are opposed to the genocidal actions they are visiting upon the Gazan civilians, in their name-just like most Americans despise Trump and his MAGAt lackeys in their anti-democratic actions here
Yeah, sorry, the evidence doesn't back that up. In a recent poll (Ha'aretz, reputable), 82% of Jewish Israelis want every last Gazan expelled, 57% (maybe 56, don't remember exactly) want all non Jewish citizens (so that's not West Bank or Gaza, but the citizens inside pre 1967 Israel) expelled, and 40 something % agreed with the idea that if they conquer a city, they should kill every man woman and child. And in a separate poll 75% were either not bothered at all or not too bothered by the hunger in Gaza.
Most Israelis want the war to end, but most would be happy to go on starving Gazans to death if they could get away with it.
Your hatred of an entire nation, while understandable based on admittedly reputable Ha’Aretz stiatistics, but “expelling” Gazans or non-Jews, is quite different from “genocide”, which involves willful “killing” their population through bombings, shootings and a campaign of starvation. I doubt 82% of Israelis would have responded to Ha’Aretz to a similar question framed as “genocide” , as opposed to “expelling” an entire ethnicity. It is too broad a brush to detest the entire nation of the opposing ethnicity. It is understandable because I believe hate begets hate. But, I agree that international sanctions are justified. “Ethnic cleansing” or “genocide” = hate begetting hate. Rather than detesting Israel, it is better to sanction their culpable leaders, instead.
That's not the definition of genocide. It isn't just about killing, it's anything that destroys the ability of a group to exist as a group, like, say, expelling them and scattering them around the world. Get your definitions straight.
And 45, 46 or so % favor actual extirmination! Killing every last man, woman and child! Let that sink in, unless you are just a bot and have no feelings.
now is the prime to recognize palestine.... there's no one to lead it, so it will back to zero in no time and hence mission accomplished...this is how you kill off an idea / dream / hope ... set it up for failure !
So what we have is a global participation in a genocide? The same countries that now exclude the US, wisely, from talks, who were threatened by Israel and the USA claiming rights to Canada, AND angry about money, have NO PROBLEM letting children die?
This shouldn't surprise us. The biggest elephant in the room is that Israel, in 1948 became a European country. Once the Europeans settled in? And England left? Israel was gifted the same gifts of seizing territory just like all the Europeans before them. The British were there WHEN the European's came. Israel is NOT a European country but they took possession just as France, England and the USA have before them. Take over and run a country in the middle east, the far eat, anywhere they wanted just to get all they could. And Israel did and does the same. I guess all the Europeans and Canadians still feel loyalty to the Europeans in Israel, but just like the rest of the world they left in a mess, they will stick together, against any Brown, Black or Asian country. It seems that the mindset of these countries is that Israel is THEM, and the rest of the countries do not exist. The empires have fallen so they stuck together now, and that is how you get a Trump as a president. Frightened white men who lost power.
It's easy for those leaders to declare that they “recognize” a palestinian state, but I dare them to look directly into the eyes of an emaciated Palestinian mother and tell her the same thing.
Over at the Lukium Substack channel American Manifesto there is a great psyop evaluation of the far right propaganda war being waged on social media Several important points made Good read https://bit.ly/46iR4hM
Just one question: Could you please elaborate what you mean by "stage an immediate military intervention to halt Israel’s genocide"? I don't disagree with the rest of the essay, FWIW.
I realize it won't and it's not Gaza they recognize. It's Mahmoud Abbas they recognize. The Palestinian state in the West Bank. It doesn't mean it doesn't have significance. We will see what it means if anything. But several head of states in the UN today acknowledged a genocide and condemned Israel for that. This is acknowledging there is a problem, and in the past. The UK in particular (of the countries that recognized Palestine) has denied there was a problem. They acknowledged suffering but used Hamas as scapegoat (again). So while I don't think it will end the genocide in the near future. It's a first step. We will have to see what they do next.
Expell = ethnic cleansing = crimes against humanity, and if it destroys the ability of a group to exist as a group, like if split up all over the world, probably does count as genocide. 82% support that, so it's a genocidal nation, so I feel just fine detesting them. Even if you don't accept the genocide part, it's no question crimes against humanity. I can detest that just fine, too.
I make exceptions for the few brave activists I hear about, Gideon Levy, Nurit Peled-Elhanan, Yuval Abraham, an 18 year old kid I heard interviewed who was going to jail rather than serve, a few others. Those I admire tremendously.
I am a Canadian and not proud of this fact. The pure hypocrisy of my government boggles my mind. My country used to have a very good reputation on the world stage. Now, all we have are major regrets for being a part of a nation that , inadvertently, supports the massacre of innocent men, women and children through the business of supplying weaponry to Israel. I, and others like myself, never signed up for this. I never voted for this party and, in relief and some small way, am very happy that I did not. All that is left is the power of prayer to stop this horror show.
Palestinians should start thinking strategically instead of imploring the world to do the right thing just because it's the right thing. Figure out how to make it in countries' interest to support them and to take action against Israel. Lobby to change the makeup of parliaments across Europe and Congress. Play chess. That is what Israel has done. They lobby and play chess. They have figured out how they can help countries that support them and how they can hurt countries that don't. Just look at Ireland's attempt to enact an Occupied Territories law and you will understand.
It's not their job to lobby Congress and European parliaments, it's OUR job, in whatever Western country we live in. People who support Palestine should stop voting for Zionist politicians. Right now Palestinians are just trying to stay alive. They don't have the big bucks to buy Senators and Presidents.
Another thought: Palestinians need to think about how to capitalize on this recognition, not just lament it as inadequate. It's a first step, an opening, an opportunity--if you make sure that the steps that follow lead to concrete change. So, again, think strategically how to capitalize on this moment. What are the next 20 small steps that will move you in the right direction?
Recognizing the Palestinian State should have been done years and years ago. What needs to be done now is to UNRECOGNIZE the genocidal State.
Unrecognize it, stop arming it and stop trading with it!
When one of these countries "concerned" about the genocide in Gaza calls for a UN peace-keeping force to enter Gaza and an embargo on all trade with Israel, then I will believe that they actually care about the Palestinians.
Disingenuous and cowardly and just as insidious as Trump, Starmer, a human right attorney is jailing and oppressing senior citizens for peacefully opposing a genocide. And Macron is still going strong with the fallacy of a 2 state solution and pushing war mongering. Starmer just embraced Trump and Mileikowsky, war criminals. No paragons of democracy or human decency these two.
Eloquent.
“. . . all the states jumping on board (to recognize a Palestinian state) have hooked their recognition to the demilitarization of a people facing genocide . . . .”
And this is contingent on the Palestinians “demonstrating progress” toward democratization, to acquiescing to their continued subjugation. So, the victims of genocide must prove something. What does Israel, the perpetrator of genocide, have to prove? What a sham.
These governments are evil and should be called out and repudiated by their own people as well as the rest of the world. The U.S., of course, is the worst of all.
No! They dont. Its being done out of embarasment.
Its been going on all of my lifetime. I've lived with , worked and spoken to Jews since I was thirteen, when I first moved into a jewish area, After a while all of my friend were Jewish,. they all lied about Israels treatment of Bedouins, and Palestinians constantly.
Now I know they were lieing. The Jewish Diaspora is just as guilty as Israel. I lived and worked with them all of my life. , I'm 82 now.
lauriemillerjade.com
I worked in mainland China a fair bit, for a chinese patron, I had to get used to him constantly lying ?. about the business we were doing ?
The islamists in China are not Arabs, therefore not " Brothers "
Bit like the Jews in Israel , Their mostly European, not middle eastern.
I'm Anglo Saxen. brought up alongside non religious Jews, And belong to no orthodox religion.
And couldnt care less about anyone who is bogged down in religion.
My advise to such people is, get out , I'm not interested in wasting my time talking about your god. Also ignorance plays a big part in what you were saying,
Chinese are great liers about their abuse. they seem to be a bit immune to others suffering.
lauriemillerjade.com
I'm not trying to prove anything ?
Just making a statement through observation .
But if you want to talk about lyeing then just look at the Jewish answer to everything . A F**ING LIE. no one can deny Israel is a lyeing state thats for sure now , and I thought the Chinese hadit.
NO
the European Jews LIE THIEVE AND MURDER
lauriemillerjade.com
Elena, your endless off point comments are getting tiresome. Please go.
Your so far off track with your observations of me that its not worth me discussing it any further
And you point out in your biggotry that anything I might say against Jews is a lie, and you will point out anything I say as a lie.
How biased is that, Youve made your mind up all ready .FFS.
If you dont,think Israel is a lyeing state ,
Then your NOT very observant,
THE REST OF THE WORLD DOES Open your eyes. If you can.
Jews have, by now, a wellearned reputation for being Liars ,Thieves and Murderers
It won't end the genocide,, but it is a good start in redressing the Palestinians' exclusion from a seat at the Table last century, while accepting Rothschild's money to give a Zionist seat at it, from which the Balfour resolution emanated.
I agree, it will do some good, even if it isn't what is really needed. It will encorage some of the more important stuff.
Like kicking Israel out of FIFA. I actually think that could do real good - drive home how much everyone detests Israel.
I do not detest Israel, but do detest Netanyahu and his ultra conservative far right religious bigot coalition. Most Israelis are opposed to the genocidal actions they are visiting upon the Gazan civilians, in their name-just like most Americans despise Trump and his MAGAt lackeys in their anti-democratic actions here
Yeah, sorry, the evidence doesn't back that up. In a recent poll (Ha'aretz, reputable), 82% of Jewish Israelis want every last Gazan expelled, 57% (maybe 56, don't remember exactly) want all non Jewish citizens (so that's not West Bank or Gaza, but the citizens inside pre 1967 Israel) expelled, and 40 something % agreed with the idea that if they conquer a city, they should kill every man woman and child. And in a separate poll 75% were either not bothered at all or not too bothered by the hunger in Gaza.
Most Israelis want the war to end, but most would be happy to go on starving Gazans to death if they could get away with it.
Yeah, I detest Israel.
Your hatred of an entire nation, while understandable based on admittedly reputable Ha’Aretz stiatistics, but “expelling” Gazans or non-Jews, is quite different from “genocide”, which involves willful “killing” their population through bombings, shootings and a campaign of starvation. I doubt 82% of Israelis would have responded to Ha’Aretz to a similar question framed as “genocide” , as opposed to “expelling” an entire ethnicity. It is too broad a brush to detest the entire nation of the opposing ethnicity. It is understandable because I believe hate begets hate. But, I agree that international sanctions are justified. “Ethnic cleansing” or “genocide” = hate begetting hate. Rather than detesting Israel, it is better to sanction their culpable leaders, instead.
That's not the definition of genocide. It isn't just about killing, it's anything that destroys the ability of a group to exist as a group, like, say, expelling them and scattering them around the world. Get your definitions straight.
And 45, 46 or so % favor actual extirmination! Killing every last man, woman and child! Let that sink in, unless you are just a bot and have no feelings.
now is the prime to recognize palestine.... there's no one to lead it, so it will back to zero in no time and hence mission accomplished...this is how you kill off an idea / dream / hope ... set it up for failure !
So what we have is a global participation in a genocide? The same countries that now exclude the US, wisely, from talks, who were threatened by Israel and the USA claiming rights to Canada, AND angry about money, have NO PROBLEM letting children die?
This shouldn't surprise us. The biggest elephant in the room is that Israel, in 1948 became a European country. Once the Europeans settled in? And England left? Israel was gifted the same gifts of seizing territory just like all the Europeans before them. The British were there WHEN the European's came. Israel is NOT a European country but they took possession just as France, England and the USA have before them. Take over and run a country in the middle east, the far eat, anywhere they wanted just to get all they could. And Israel did and does the same. I guess all the Europeans and Canadians still feel loyalty to the Europeans in Israel, but just like the rest of the world they left in a mess, they will stick together, against any Brown, Black or Asian country. It seems that the mindset of these countries is that Israel is THEM, and the rest of the countries do not exist. The empires have fallen so they stuck together now, and that is how you get a Trump as a president. Frightened white men who lost power.
Exactly!
It's easy for those leaders to declare that they “recognize” a palestinian state, but I dare them to look directly into the eyes of an emaciated Palestinian mother and tell her the same thing.
The Nazi Propaganda War On Social Media
Over at the Lukium Substack channel American Manifesto there is a great psyop evaluation of the far right propaganda war being waged on social media Several important points made Good read https://bit.ly/46iR4hM
That link didn’t work for me but I went to my Substack page & looked up Lukium …
Thanks for the tip.
Glad you found it....he posts really great insights
It doesn't just benefit Israel. It will inevitably benefit the pockets of our president and his family.
Just one question: Could you please elaborate what you mean by "stage an immediate military intervention to halt Israel’s genocide"? I don't disagree with the rest of the essay, FWIW.
I realize it won't and it's not Gaza they recognize. It's Mahmoud Abbas they recognize. The Palestinian state in the West Bank. It doesn't mean it doesn't have significance. We will see what it means if anything. But several head of states in the UN today acknowledged a genocide and condemned Israel for that. This is acknowledging there is a problem, and in the past. The UK in particular (of the countries that recognized Palestine) has denied there was a problem. They acknowledged suffering but used Hamas as scapegoat (again). So while I don't think it will end the genocide in the near future. It's a first step. We will have to see what they do next.
Expell = ethnic cleansing = crimes against humanity, and if it destroys the ability of a group to exist as a group, like if split up all over the world, probably does count as genocide. 82% support that, so it's a genocidal nation, so I feel just fine detesting them. Even if you don't accept the genocide part, it's no question crimes against humanity. I can detest that just fine, too.
I make exceptions for the few brave activists I hear about, Gideon Levy, Nurit Peled-Elhanan, Yuval Abraham, an 18 year old kid I heard interviewed who was going to jail rather than serve, a few others. Those I admire tremendously.
I am a Canadian and not proud of this fact. The pure hypocrisy of my government boggles my mind. My country used to have a very good reputation on the world stage. Now, all we have are major regrets for being a part of a nation that , inadvertently, supports the massacre of innocent men, women and children through the business of supplying weaponry to Israel. I, and others like myself, never signed up for this. I never voted for this party and, in relief and some small way, am very happy that I did not. All that is left is the power of prayer to stop this horror show.
Palestinians should start thinking strategically instead of imploring the world to do the right thing just because it's the right thing. Figure out how to make it in countries' interest to support them and to take action against Israel. Lobby to change the makeup of parliaments across Europe and Congress. Play chess. That is what Israel has done. They lobby and play chess. They have figured out how they can help countries that support them and how they can hurt countries that don't. Just look at Ireland's attempt to enact an Occupied Territories law and you will understand.
It's not their job to lobby Congress and European parliaments, it's OUR job, in whatever Western country we live in. People who support Palestine should stop voting for Zionist politicians. Right now Palestinians are just trying to stay alive. They don't have the big bucks to buy Senators and Presidents.
Another thought: Palestinians need to think about how to capitalize on this recognition, not just lament it as inadequate. It's a first step, an opening, an opportunity--if you make sure that the steps that follow lead to concrete change. So, again, think strategically how to capitalize on this moment. What are the next 20 small steps that will move you in the right direction?